Did anyone watch this debate last night? I was disappointed in it. I felt that both of them did not embarass their parties, but Palin was a huge disappointment because she wouln't answer most of the questions. I would hate to think that she couldn't answer the questions so I will believe that she had an agenda and refused to waver from it. I was hoping that I would see some of what everyone thinks is "special" about her, but I didn't. Oh well, I am more convinced that I am voting for the right person when I vote Barrack/Biden in November.
Any other opinions?
Friday, October 03, 2008
VP debate
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36 comments:
I watched it and was not impressed with her. I really think the Rebublicans are suporting her out of default. She wouldn't be most peoples first choice but she is McCains choice so they have to do their best to stay in line with their party. I know this is petty but it drove me nuts how many times she said the word "ALSO" I counted like 20 times in the last half hour alone. I wonder if anyone took the time to count the total. I bet someone did.
I liked Biden more than her he seemed to know what he was talking about and of course he has the experiance the democratic ticket needs. I was surprised that he got chocked up near the end.
I said this in my other post. the fact that McCain wants to cut taxes for the rich along with corporate taxes really bothers me. It's that ole saying the rich get richer and the poor get poorer. Not that I consider myself poor by any means but things sure aren't getting any easier around here. Are household expenses have gone up tremendously this past year or so and I don't think I would feel it near as much if I were "RICH". Now is not the time to be giving tax cuts they need to get out of the war and fix the economy!
I read a good article this morning on yahoo that cleared up a few things that each of them claimed about the other that the other denied. (Make sense) It really is interesting how they ALL spin things in their direction.
I would also like to say that I also thought it was funny that she also said in the very begining "Hey" is it alright for me to also call you Joe?
I must have watched a different debate, because I counted 8 "misrepresentations" on the part of Biden....he either has a problem telling the truth or his preparers aren't doing their job. I thought Palin did a great job and stood her ground with the elder statesman. All of you kill me with the pass you give BO on the credibility and experience issues. Palin has done more in her time as Gov than Obama has as a senator. I have not heard one definite plan from him, and have not seen one thing he has accomplished besides funding for ACORN and support for the senators involved in the Countrywide and FM/FM diasters. What is so "special" about him. He won't release anything from his past, not even thesis papers. He is unknown and everyone is just gobbling up the medias idea of him. He is so far left, it would be worse than Carter if he gets in. You say you want change, lets just hope you like that change since he hasn't spelled that out yet. Palin has caused change and is the Washington outsider that pundits claim is what is needed to clean up corruption, but you put her down for being "regular people". I think I will wait until after the election to check back here. I have had enough koolaid for this year. Hope everyone has a good fall.
Tracy, you really seem to take this discussion personally. People have as much right to dislike Palin as you have to dislike Obama, but no one else is getting so wound up about it. I for one would be sad to see you leave the blog over something upon which we're all just going to have to agree to disagree.
I for one haven't seen the debate yet. I'm planning on watching the replay on BBC over the weekend. I heard though that there were lots of drinking games going on for every time she said "tip" and "with all due respect."
MJ, you used "also" three times in the post following the post where you complained about Palin's use of "also". EVERYBODY DRINK!
vicki, i'm so glad you're keeping it light...i for one decided to stay out of it after unintentionally stuck my big foot in my big mouth during the first post, and sincerely apoligize that it was taken so personally
Kristen, I never got the impression from that post that your beef with McCain was based on his disability, and I too am really sad it was taken so personally. The thing is, in discussions like this, IMO, you can't go in thinking you're going to change someone's mind. That's not what it's about. It's just sharing opinions. That's all. There's nothing personal in it. We've all known each other for like 35 years now, so if we can't have a lively discussion with each other without getting our panties in a bind, this blog will be boring. I enjoy the political talk (Steve doesn't hold back, but I wish Mullen were here) and it makes for interesting reading. I'm not upset by the fact that my more conservative friends think I'm a tree hugging liberal, and hope that they feel the same.
Rambling now. Sorry. Off to make some bath bombs.
Vicki seriously?? did you not realize my use of the word "also" was a big joke, do you not get my sense of humor???
Anyway I too would be sorry to see anyone leave what a shame we ARE all adults here and should be allowed to voice are opinions. Geesh we finally get the blog alive again and it gets blown out of proportion, YIKES
Now anyone else care to comment on what they thought of the debate.
Yes, MJ, I got it. Hence the drinking joke. This is the problem with internet forums/blogs/chatrooms - you can't judge someone's tone because you can't hear their voice. Maybe that's why people are getting wound up, also.
DRINK!!!
if I would have drank everytime she said also I would have been flat out on the Floor, I thought your drink comment was in referance to the koolaid ;)
DRANK!
I read on my American Expats forum that apparently college students all over the country were using the debate for drinking games. Another word which required a drink was "maverick".
I haven't played a good drinking game since 1992. Wonder if we could have a virtual drinking game on the blog?
ok, this may be a blonde thing, even though i'm not really all that blonde anymore (child rearing and old age i guess) but i do not (think i)get the koolaid reference
Tracy,
I don't suppose you see this, so I'm pointing it out:
When someone says something positive about a Dem or liberal, you get frustrated and angry.
When you say someone positive about a Pub or conservative... nothing happens.
Do you see that?
Then you insinuate that anyone with an opinion different than your own must be drinking "Koolaid." That insults the PEOPLE who don't share your world view - not some political candidate.
I must have missed the post where someone insulted YOU (not a candidate you support) enough to justify this reprisal or make you leave - but, in any case: see 'ya.
All:
Before the blog, I only remembered you as high school students - in my mind, you were all still 17. You all still had the outlook, ideas, and opinions of the kids you used to be: Mullen is political; Vicki is dramatic; Donna is a nonconformist; (ahem) is a druggie; (cough) is an conceited asshole; etc.
Getting to read you as adults has shown me that you're not who you were, or in the category I lumped you - you are each a beautiful snowflake (or minimally, a flake) - but for the most part, mature, adult flakes.
I hope that the reverse is true: that you've learned that adult me is not the (insert negative adjective) kid I was, or came off as. I'd like to think I conquered some of my 'issues.' I hope, anyway.
Anyway, thanks for that.
But if we all have to tip-toe around and worry about offending each other I'm not really interested, either. I can read fluff anywhere, and frankly - and I REALLY don't mean any disrespect by this: your fluff is just as boring as everyone else's.
Tracey, I've enjoyed your posts. It's nice to know I'm not only only fiscal conservative here.
Steve-Non-conformist, huh? Ha! Yeah, I tried so hard to be different; I had such an attitude. Truth be told, I often still feel like a space alien around most people.
For the record (;-) I didn't have a negative opinion of you from high school.
As for politics, my husband keeps telling me that I get too upset over it and take it all too seriously. I find it hard not to when these people have control over my life. *shrug* I guess that hasn't changed about me.
Steve, are you saying I'm a drama queen!?!? *storms off in a huff*
Like Donna said, I didn't have a negative opinion of you in HS. Actually, I can't think of anyone I had a negative opinion of.
Likewise, fluff can be boring, and while I enjoy sharing stories about our kids or our dogs or vacations or whatever, when we get down and dirty it keeps things interesting.
Steve you comment made me laugh I never thoguth of myself as a beautiful snowflake before.
I'm just a flake. :-)
ok, you can still call me the dumb blonde then, but can someone please explain the koolaid reference?!
Kristen,
Kool aid is a reference to the Jonestown massacre - their crazy leader talked all his all followers into drinking poisoned Kool-aid thereby committing mass suicide. I think Jones was some kind of socialist or hippy or something - not sure. I DO know that the suicide was perpetrated because the gov't was closing in on them, and death was thought preferable to surrender.
I don't know which "screaming head" coined the term, Rush Limbaugh seems likely.
Pubs commonly throw this around (it's almost a "talking point" in some Pub circles) insinuating that either:
1. Dems can't think for themselves and must drinking some "poisoned kool-aid" to believe what the Dem leadership is saying; or
2. The Dems are too stupid to realize that their leadership is leading them astray.
Interestingly (to me, anyway), whenever I see it used by a Pub (and I have LOTS) it seems to be in place of a reasoned reply. IOW, instead of criticizing Dem policies or offering logic to support their own opinion, they write off the Dems as 'drinking kool-aid' and shut down any further meaningful exchange.
...as happened here.
thanks steve, and in that case...i'd say that was offensive and sorta like "the pot calling the kettle black"??!!
I saw the debates and I saw both sides. I thought Palin did very well overall -and connected with the "masses" in a corny, homey kind of way. Although she really didn't answer any questions and kept going back to Alaska/Oil& Energy at every opportunity. I saw Biden speadk to facts, albeit a bit on the boring side. I thought when he was grinning he was really saying "I really would like to smack that bitch" (because she caught him misrepresnting some fact and caught him in it).
Overall, I think if you are undecided you may have swung more towards the REPs, because Palin didn't fall on her face and showed she was "an average Joe" (ala her opening remark). If you were looking for substance, there was a bit more from the DEMS. I don't think it was a make/or brake debate by any means. This is going to be an interesting election...it seems like the avg person is in favor of the DEMS, the small business owners/Richer with the republicans. I'm normally on the REP side, but I'm leaning towards a DEM vote....
I only hope that Tracy does still post and hasn't drank any koolade. Steve, Vicki & I can all agree to disagree on subjects, although in the end I think we all have similar concerns and agree more than we know. Can't we all just get along?? (this ISN'T High School!!).
To be fair, I think it's kind of a knee-jerk reaction for some people and they don't really think about it or the fact that it's an insult.
Also, when humans say or hear something enough times, they begin to believe it's true whether it is or not.
Altho, that's the definition of "brain-washed," isn't it?
As I've made clear in numerous (lengthy) other posts, I think Dems AND Pubs are both brain-washed. ;)
Well, I wouldn't have made reference to a drinking game had I realized that the kool-aid comment was a reference to the Jonestown Massacre. Bad taste. My bad.
Jeff, I get the feeling that you and I are waving at each other from opposite sides of the fence. Steve, I don't know where you are dude! Some things you say, I totally agree, others, I think "What the hell is he talking about?" That could be because you're a lot smarter than me though.
I still love and respect both of you though, even though I'm right and you're wrong. ;-)
Okay, I've seen the debate. Here's my thoughts, in no particular order. I'm warning you now, there will be some effing and blinding:
1. What is with that fucking winking thing Palin does? This isn't a goddam beauty pageant!! It's a VP debate! I don't want a leader that thinks it's appropriate to wink at someone like oh, for example, the British Prime Minister. Maybe that's how she deals with Putin when he "rears his head". She winks at him. She'll be getting her tits out next.
2. If she said "maverick" or "also" one more time, I was preparing to throw something at the screen.
3. She never answered a question. Not one. The impression I got was that if it was a topic she was well rehearsed on, she'd rephrase the question and then answer her own rephrase so that it sounded like it made sense. If she couldn't answer the question, she turned the topic to energy.
4. "Joe Sixpack"? I'm not even touching that one.
5. Biden said "McCain" too much. It was like he was almost plugging the other candidate.
6. When he smiled it looked like he was thinking, "I want to slap that bitch". It looked a bit sleazy and wasn't appropriate to the debate.
7. Her grammar is disgusting. She drops her "-ing" endings and talks like she's at a PTA coffee morning. But that's okay, because when she meets Nicholas Sarkozy, she can just wink at him.
In short, I think Biden won, but he was too respectful. He should have (and could have) wiped the floor with Palin, but the press would have been all over him because she's a woman. People are saying she did well, but only because she didn't tank. Do we really want that mediocrity in our leaders?
In case you haven't figured it out, I'm a bleeding heart liberal who leans toward Obama/Biden. I don't think Sarah Palin is an idiot. I think she's quite an intelligent woman who is out of her depth. She shouldn't be in the position she's in, but she's here now and I don't think she knows what to do about it. Knowing that you're out of your depth is in and of itself a measure of smarts. I think she was wooed and now she's thinking, "Oh shit."
As far as the whole I'm-a-hockey-mom-I-know-Joe-Sixpack-won't-that-make-me-a-good-VP angle, I don't want a leader I could have a beer with. I don't want a leader I could be friends with. No offense to my friends but I can't see any of us in the White House and I certainly wouldn't want any of us running the country. I want a leader I can revere. I want a leader I can respect. I want a leader that is very knowledgeable (and I'm not just talking about book smarts) who can talk effectively to a variety of people on a variety of topics. I want a leader who understands the big picture and where we fit in it. Maybe that's not Obama/Biden - I'm not sure - but I'm DAMN SURE it's not McCain/ Palin.
And in the spirit of fairness, factcheck.org (if I can count correctly) says that Biden bent the truth 14 times, Palin 18 times. So no one's exactly being forthright, are they?
I watched the debate the other night and thought it was rather predictable. Although I did find it more interesting than the debate between McCain and Obama.
I don't think that if you are undecided that either candidate did a good enough job to sway the viewers.
I'm sticking with my candidate. I'm voting McCain/Palin.
curious Jamie since you haven't posted much is there a particular reason why your voting Rep?
Vicki great recap I was hoping you counted the "alsos"
Sonya where are ya, you started this post how about your 2 cents
Jeff:
That was a great, objective review of what I saw, too (seems you're drinking neither blue, nor red, kool-aid).
Average Joe = Dem; rich = Rep is classic. I don't know how Bush got so many wage-slaves to vote for the party advocating tax breaks for the rich, pulling back social services, etc. Oh wait, yeah... it was by fear mongering, homophobia, and nationalism (and tampering with votes, too, of course.)
I think the Neocons should've change the name to the "Capitalist" party; and the Dems to the "Labor Union" party.
Vicki:
"Some things you say, I totally agree, others, I think "What the hell is he talking about?" "
- lol. I guess I could explain it, but how many frickin' words would THAT take me.
"That could be because you're a lot smarter than me though."
- well, naturally. ;)
That was the 'Palin wink', there, btw.
FWIW, I totally agree with your assessment and I think it was fairly objective, given your lean to BO.
Partisans aren't going to switch their views based on these debates, and NO candidate (to me, anyway) seems to have an inspiring blend of charisma, knowledge, experience, and oratory skill. Any real discussion about politics is doomed by staunch (usually unjustifiable, IMO) partisanship. Blinders go on to "our" candidate's shortcomings, and a magnifying glass goes on to the other guy's.
The two-party system makes every election a false dichotomy - and most voters seem to be pretty content with that arrangement.
Acuz dey stoopid.
As long as we're arguing among ourselves over which party is LESS criminal, they can both keep right on being criminals. It's all a smokescreen to keep our minds off of voting for a third party.
I think the average American is pretty reasonable, pretty centrist. We're all able to make sacrifices for the common good, help our neighbor, fight for what's right, and make fair compromises on tough issues. We WANT to be united.
Ask yourself why our leadership NEVER sells THAT thinking.
Steve-I wish the neocons really were Capitalists; that's something I could really get behind! I have to laugh every time someone accuses Bush of being a fiscal conservative; he's no friend of the free market.
I don't know if anyone will see this, but I'm ready for my cameo Mr. De Mille.
Vicki: Thank you for wishing I was here. It's likely you're one of the few.
Steve: Was I "political" in high school? Perhaps I was, I don't recall.
Maybe another time I will offer a more detailed commentary on this topic [doubtful], but right now, all things considered, I'd rather spend time with my daughter and write about baseball.
MULLEN!! MULLENMULLENMULLENMULLENMULLEN!
I've missed you! You don't have to talk about politics. Talk about baseball, your daughter, your house, whatever, just talk to us dude!
Glad to see you, albeit virtually. Steve's been trying to smoke you out for months.
Mr Mullen!!!!! I am so happy to see your name!!!
I remember you being political in high school but then everyone changes - don't they. Please post some new pictures of your daughter - I would love to see how beautiful she is now!! Welcome back - you were missed!!!!
Todd Mullen...WELCOME BACK.
I'm with you on the Family time issue. Only until recently did Steve, Vicki, MJ (& Tracy -if she's still "blurking") suck me into active Blogging with these political "debates".
PLEASE MAKE MORE CAMEOS!
P.S. -You must be old and/or sarcastic. We had many a walk to/from school together....and I always remember you discussing politics (aside from recapping episodes of Cheers and/or the Girls BB Games (play by play).
Vicki: Thank you for wishing I was here. It's likely you're one of the few.
I call "bullshit."
...and nearly conceded your un-smoke-out-ability. For my next trick, I was going to start extolling the virtues fascism.
My work here is done.
Clarification: I meant one of the few who wish I was "here" as in "here discussing politics" - not "here at the blog." I apologize for the ambiguity.
I call bullshit again.
Given the choice, I bet anyone here would rather have you discussing politics exclusively than not here at all.
And if your only contribution is to pop up and say "all's well," thanks for that - and I'm glad to hear it!
Btw, a benign dictatorship is a really efficient form of government - saves the taxpayers lots of money. I'm just sayin'.
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